My Review of 2019 CGI "Dumbo"

Source of image: IMDB.com

Walt Disney Not a Coney Island Con-Artist with No Soul But Was An American Idealist with a Heart for His Mother

Review of “Dumbo” to counter some other reviews

**** (Four Stars out of Five)

By: Ron Baxley, Jr., author and travel specialist

The “Saving Mr. Banks” film a few years back dealt with Walt Disney’s father issues as well as author P.L. Travers’, and to me, the modern CGI Tim Burton “Dumbo” deals more with Walt’s mother issues.

Past critics have tried to paint the CGI modern “Dumbo” as an indictment against Walt Disney forming the big theme-park of Disneyland, but Walt Disney was not a Coney Island con-artist with no soul like V.A. Vandavere (Michael Keaton) with his overly-elaborate, garish Dreamland theme-park. Keaton plays Vandavere, affecting a somewhat British dialect at times with the social climbing dialect of the poorer New York boroughs in the early part of the last century. The screen-writer and director could have explored it a bit more, but V.A. Vandavere has tinges of Gatsby, climbing to the ranks of grand showmanship a la P.T. Barnum whose highly fictionalized musical biopic made its appearance not long ago, “The Greatest Showman.” Burton’s “Gatsby” is accompanied by a more intelligent Daisy, Eva Green, as the French street performer, Colette Marchant. Vandavere keeps Colette at his side more like a jewel that reflects back on him as Colette describes it. Like Devito, Green gives a good performance and a complicated one as she is one of the more developed characters within the film. She is no Lillian Disney, the doting, supportive wife of Walt, so this relationship is yet another indication the screenwriter and director probably did not intend Vandavere to be a satirical mirror of Walt. 

Granted, Walt Disney was a bit of a social climbing Gatsby himself in some ways. But he was not the heartless entertainer who peddled a soulless Midway, which as shown in this film is more the equivalent of a dark Pleasure Island versus the bright Disneyland Uncle Walt wanted to be a shared experience for the young, old, and the young at heart. In addition, one cannot imagine the purveyor of nature films that was Walt to go after an animal, no matter how special Dumbo the flying elephant was, just for some bucks. Also, Walt Disney may have stated, “It’s kind of nice to do the impossible” which is close to Vandavere’s statement of “making the impossible possible.” But Vandavere’s sounds more forced where Walt’s sounded more humble, like an “aw, shucks” statement from a boy from Missouri who knows he’s “done good.” This is yet another reason I do not see them as the same.  

No, it’s not Burton trying to make Walt Disney out to be a villain as some critics have stated. In “Dumbo”, it’s Burton, as he has done in other films, exploring the psychology of characters and of Disney himself. Many Disney fans know the story of how Walt and Roy, his brother, together bought their parents, Elias and Flora after the success of “Snow White”, a house in North Hollywood. Flora kept complaining about the smell of gas leaking in the home, and Walt sent his repairmen from the study to look at it. They thought they had the problem fixed, but Florida succumbed to the gas eventually and passed away. Elias survived. Some have speculated that the deaths of mothers in Disney films from “Bambi” on forward relate to this historic occurrence. (spoiler alert) Granted, Dumbo’s mother is not killed in the film, but her life is threatened quite a few times, and the intense sadness of Dumbo being separated from her is emphasized. The moments of Dumbo’s separation from her and his reactions were as almost as poignant to me as the original. I think Burton and the screenwriter are thematically exploring the psyche of Disney himself, not painting him to be some kind of sideshow charlatan as other critics have attested.

There are some classic Disney ideas in the film. I thought Danny Devito’s plucky take on the ringmaster and owner of the circus who sees his performers as more of a family matched classic Disney. The child actors did not per se as they lacked the enthusiasm of some of the ones from past Disney films. Of course, unlike Dumbo, they had lost their mother through her passing away, and this figures into the themes discussed earlier. Therefore, perhaps it was better than their performances were a bit subdued for this reason. Themes of loss and grief are particularly explored through the young actress Nico Parker, who emotes sadness very well. Nevertheless, she could have leaned more toward ecstatic joy when they began to help Dumbo. 

Colin Farell, who plays her father Holt Farrier, is back from the war to return to performing with horses he discovers has been sold and has been placed to work with the elephants (how he and his family meet Dumbo, etc.). Farell plays Farrier with a stoicism and bravery of a man who lost his arm to war but keeps fighting, keeps trying. At times, he does not get very excited or as happy when they are trying to help Dumbo as I would have liked, but I think that fits in with what his character has gone through. He has lost a wife and his arm in battle, after all. 

Next, not giving up against all odds is another classic Disney theme in the film. Another classic idea within the film is that a group of good friends or family can band together to do their best to defeat evil. There are definite lines between the two as in most Disney films.

At one point, the modern CGI “Dumbo” ’s score, which seems to have been done by a whole teams of musicians, lulled me almost to sleep along with the dark cinematography – something long-time Burton collaborator Danny Elfman never did to me. Nevertheless, the song “Baby Mine” (based on the original one from the animated film) was suitably poignant in all its incarnations in the film (the ukulele one reminding of the late Hawaiian Iz’s “Somewhere Over the Rainbow” cover/ version). The song, multiple times and ways, is related to all interactions between Dumbo and his mother from whom he was separated. 

The usage of that song and the wide-eyed, realistic CGI qualities of Dumbo with the life-like noises brought tears to my eyes. Dumbo’s cuteness as he explored his world as a young animal made the audience and me smile and laugh as well. I think the artists did a good job of making Dumbo (as well as the other circus animals) appear fairly realistic. He certainly beats the slightly wooden CGI characters of yesteryear though not necessarily rivaling the hand-drawn classic Dumbo.   

Many of the CGI visuals were very colorful and extremely intricate. They did bring me into the circus and theme-park worlds very well. It’s just at time that the lighting within those worlds was a little darker than I would have liked. However, I get that this was being used to create a somber mood.

Being only occasionally, if not rarely bored by the score and some of the acting at times and darker lit scenes made me decrease my rank of the film a bit. However, I give the modern CGI “Dumbo” a good rank because I think it does deal with classic Disney themes and does not try to tear down Walt Disney the way other reviewers have postulated that it does.  

Christopher Lucas' Top Disney... is OUT TODAY!

I have been posting my review of Christopher Lucas' Top Disney at various book sites today. Look for it at the major book sites and bookstores. 

A Wonderful, Magic Reference Book even the Disney Sorcerers May Not Be Able to Handle!

Review by: Ron Baxley, Jr., fantasy and science fiction author, Oz author, Disney Avenue contributing writer, “Disney, Baxley, and Oz” blogger, Disney fan-fic author, reporter, and travel specialist

Five Stars (*****)

There is a “magic book” out that may baffle most Sorcerers’ Apprentices and may even baffle some of the Disney Sorcerers themselves. How this “magic book” contains so much information is truly a marvel! Top Disney: 100 Top Ten Lists of the Best of Disney, from Man to the Mouse and Beyond (Lyons Press) by author Christopher Lucas is an exhaustive, truly magical reference of lists of all things Disney from “Aladdin” to the zebras of “The Lion King” and most things before, after, and between those films themselves.

From Disney Parks to songs to obscure films and animated shorts to Disney figures notable and perhaps somewhat unknown, Lucas’ reference book runs the gamut. Fans of Disney who have been so for many decades are sure to find quite a few things they did not know before reading this book. I personally did not know some of the westerns, a few of the modern films, and even some of the CEOs and animators, for example.

By the way, Lucas does not get into some of the political or controversial aspects associated with Disney (one minor quibble I had initially was that he did not mention some of the issues surrounding a certain former CEO of the company, but this is not that kind of book). He also picks a few figures and aspects of Disney from the 90s and new millennium I might not (he does so, I think, to be representative of material from the company through many decades, not just classic Disney material). However, he handles writing the book as most excellent journalists would, without bias and to inform on a great scale. Also of note is that the publisher and he included many great visuals of posters, stills, and photographs interspersed throughout the book to aid visual learners and to make the book as digest-able as a very large Eat Me Cake.

In short (shorter than Sorcerer Apprentice Mickey this time), the Disney Sorcerers themselves will be flooded with information from this terrific tome but will find the parting of the waters has been well-completed by Lucas. And no brooms were harmed in the writing of this book or review.

James Krych – ey!... Oye, vey, He’s an Ozian!

I have had had a couple of blogposts focused on Disney at Disney, Baxley, and Oz the past few weeks, so I decided to do an Oz one. I made inquiries on my Facebook page to see if any Oz authors would like to be interviewed, and James Krych agreed to be placed under the fairly soft scrutiny that is an interview with whom some Ozians have called a Lavender Bear and some Disney fans and friends have called a Pooh Bear. 

James himself would probably be more of a mix of the Tin Woodman, Nick Chopper, and Fyter the Tin Soldier because of his military background with the energy of Disney’s Tigger (he has to as he raises two boys, works a full-time job, and works as an author). I have known James for several years and have become his friend. Unlike some of my other Facebook friends, I have met him in person at a con and have carried on numerous past conversations with him. I have also reviewed his work and know him and his books fairly well. Before I post my questions and his answers, though, I want to first share James’ submitted bio.:

James Walter (J.W.) Krych had his first novel, From Neptune to Earth, as a collaborative work between him and David Cuciz, a member of the Swiss Army at the time. The Flight to Oz Book I: Arrival was his first-ever Science Fiction/Fantasy story based on the characters and world of L. Frank Baum's Wizard of Oz series. The Flight to Oz Book II: Anusha of Oz was a direct sequel to Book I and included a new Original Character with Asperger's Syndrome. This Point in Time is the first book based on his Flight to Oz universe and deals with the Holocaust and forgiveness. Starting in 1988, James served in the US Military, finally retiring as a CW2 in 2011. As a Warrant Officer, he was first assigned to the Joint Force Headquarters in Columbus, Ohio, preparing for natural and/or man-made disasters. Relocating to South Carolina, he became a member of the 218^th MEB and finished his last two years of service on active duty orders as the Brigade S-6 IT Signal Warrant Officer for the CCMRF, the CBRNE (Chemical, Biological, Radiological, Nuclear and Explosives) Consequence Management Response Force, Mission, where circumstances would have had to be terribly bad in order to be called up. He and his wife, Lori, and their two special-needs boys live in the Charleston, SC, area, along with their cats. He can be reached on Deviant Art: http://centurion030.deviantart.com/ and on Facebook:https://www.facebook.com/TheFlightToOz

...

There James is…Captain Amer-i-caaaaaaaaa!... There he is… Captain Amer-i-caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa:

James may not share my fondness for puns, but he definitely shares my fondness for parodies, so I think he will like the above parody of the old Miss America song. I made it masculine too to match the interview subject. He is a patriotic guy and does have some super hero aspects, so I thought it fit.

Now on to my questions…

11)   Your series takes place partially in the Land of Oz. What do the works of L. Frank Baum mean to you? How about popular culture versions of Oz? 

Like many, I was introduced to the Wizard of Oz via the annual Halloween TV specials where it and "King Kong" (the 1930s version) were shown. Later on, I remember seeing the Journey Back to Oz. It wasn't until the mid-1990’s where I learned about the books -- as in there was more than one! In fact, it was after a TI 99/4A Multi User Group conference in Lima, Ohio, where I learned from the organizer, Dr. Charles Good, about the 14 total that L. Frank Baum had written. That had to have been either 1994 or 1995. When I met my then fiance, Lori Geiger, back in 2002, she mentioned that she had named her car "Ozma" and that led to some serious Internet research! I have since surpassed her extensive knowledge of Oz as I have written my own stories…

Baum’s works are neat. They are more whimsical than those of C.S. Lewis or J.R.R. Tolkien. In fact, the puns from the books are painful for me. The characters are probably the most fun thing for me to read about. Of course, Oz is a large land and not every place is peaceful and safe; Mr. Baum made that pretty clear. 

Source: Wikipedia

Regarding popular culture versions. I'll lead off with an anecdote about that: I was discussing my books with one of our ABA (applied behavior analysis) therapists and mentioned Ozma -- which resulted in the deer in the headlight look. She was pretty familiar with the "Wicked" book but not much else. The versions remind me of the blind men describing an elephant -- all different yet all part of the same animal. Some of the newest have been dark ( "Emerald City" comes to mind), and others are a neat mix of the MGM Movie and the books -- Boomerang's “Dorothy and the Wizard of Oz”, for example.

Source: Harper Collins web-site

I say let the versions blossom!

(James later explained the concept of the ABA therapists mentioned above and what they do for his sons on the autism spectrum. He wrote, “An ABA, applied behavior analysis, therapist is a person who works with a special-needs child and employs strategies such as positive reinforcement to enable life-long tools for that child to use. It doesn't "cure" autism, but it does give the child skills to function in the world -- with the caveat that autism is a spectrum with very low functioning on one end and high functioning at the other; with everything in between.” Note: I knew most of these strategies from my days as an educator but did not know the exact term for the type of therapist.) 

2.) Do you think people who use traditional fantasy works as jumping off points for new work should adhere to everything in the source material? Why/why not? 

I take things quite literally, and I learned very early on just how much the original material from L. Frank Baum alone was contradictory. I finally resolved my own dilemma by taking the best parts for my own stories. For me, it boils down to two major concepts: first is that the source material provides a great sounding board -- not simply stone tablet laws. Second, as an author, we can either enhance or degrade the original stories. I chose to enhance the original stories by having the original characters face wholly new situations with new, original characters.

 (Note: One of the ways Baum contradicted himself was making O.Z. Diggs, the Wizard of Oz, more of a co-conspirator with the kidnapping of Princess Ozma by Mombi in The Marvelous Land of Oz but later amending that. By the way, the cover below has a truncated title of The Marvelous Land of Oz, I do believe, much like The Wonderful Wizard of Oz is often truncated to The Wizard of Oz – even in book form. I chose this image because it was more vibrant than the cover scans of vintage “… Marvelous..” covers. Now back to questions for James…)

Source: Oz Wiki  

3.) How long have you been a writer? How many years have you been a published author?  

I wrote stories as a young man, and during the mid-1990’s, I also wrote political commentaries under my "Fireside Chats." Sadly, those are probably lost to history as the hard drive and the TI it was attached to was given to a friend in California. My first published work was a co-authored project, "From Neptune to Earth". That was released by Good Deal Games and J2 Games. Several of the un-edited chapters can be read at the following site: http://www.gooddealgames.com/Fan_Fiction.htm . In 2015, my first Oz Novel, "The Flight to Oz Book I: Arrival" was published via CreateSpace.

Source: Amazon.com

4.) Does your personal life ever figure into your writing? In what way? 

Where do I begin?! Many of the best writing examples have come from my own experiences and especially those of my military career. Normally, they'll show up as little "Easter Eggs" here and there or as subtle references.

5.) You have had at least one disabled character in your series, a child with high functioning autism. Explain why including characters with disabilities is so important to you. How can a disabled character be a good fit in a fantastic world such as Oz? 

Those on the Autism Spectrum have so much to offer to us -- even the low functioning ones. For me, it's also a reflection of my own personal life. I have three sons who are all on the spectrum. Brandon and Jack, here in South Carolina, have autism, and Treyton, in Ohio, has Asperger's. Much of their own little quirks and traits found their way into my original characters. In fact, the one scene in Book II where Anusha lined up things all dress-right-dress, exactly in a row, comes directly from something Treyton did when he was little -- flower pots up all in a row. 

For a fantasy world, the special-needs can appear to be almost magical in their abilities. Anusha's pattern recognition and how that saved her family is one example. I was very brutal when it came to Anusha's parents' struggles in getting to come to grips with her Asperger's. Betsy's grief and confusion are very much part of being a special-needs parent. I have already included notes for Book III on Betsy's experiences being used in a bigger way. Some children from Ix are found to be displaying similar traits, and Queen Zixi wants Betsy to be a teacher/therapist. -Just thoughts right now. Of course, during the Double Enthronement Ceremony at the end of Act 3, Book III, Anusha will have watched the Throne Room's remodeling, so she will be comfortable there. In Book II, Ozma gives her the title of "Keeper of the Throne Room Layout."

Source: Amazon.com

6.) Some of your works appear to have allegorical facets -- particularly ones that are Judeo-Christian. Why did you want to incorporate those facets into your fiction? Is your faith important to you and why?  

I have often said it before and will do so again: no literature is free from the worldview and biases of its creator. I'm reminded that C.S. Lewis and J.R.R. Tolkien wanted to include Christian themes in fantasy. I do that same in my works because it's part of me and I want to show how such timeless and eternal values can be woven into fiction and fantasy. In Book I, I especially used the themes of Love and what love needed to be in order to defeat evil. I even have the Ixians of Book II able to smell scents almost like a dog and Jonathan, one of my OC's, is a Jewish man and his scent to the Ixians is "like one of milk and honey." I also included much of Ix's past as being influenced by Jewish Captives from the fall of Jerusalem and the Destruction of the Second Temple -- circa A.D. 70. 

Jonathan's Jewishness will play a huge part in Act 3 of Book III. Let's just say he'll have to confront the greatest user of evil magic while being non-magical and fighting the temptation to do something. He'll have to trust in the One Who Has Kept His People.

He and Betsy already say terms of endearment to each other in Hebrew and that will continue as their love grows and they grow as a couple and as parents. The Loves of Oz that is included in each book models the Four Loves that come from the Bible. 

Love is a vital theme that connects all of the books that have been written, and Lord willing, will be written. 

Probably the biggest allegorical use of the Judeo-Christian worldview can be found in the novella "This Point in Time." In "Ojo in Oz", Ozma sent the gypsies (editor’s note: who James calls the more modern term Romani in his fiction) back to wander to countries of Southern Europe--1933--and in the year 2045 must ask for forgiveness from a direct descendant. I really enjoyed the research and character building for that story, and I believe that many important lessons can be drawn from reading the story.

7.) Do you ever deal with politics satirically in your series? If so, how?  

I am thinking about how to answer this. Certainly, the stories deal with such topics as evil, as it is always part of the human, and half-human, experience and as such it can never be remedied, “therapied”, educated, or whatnot away. I wholeheartedly reject any notion that humanity's most evil dictators can somehow become "rehabilitated" by merely being jailed in Oz! There is a scene in Book I where Ozma has to look into the heart of the evil, and the Abyss looks back. I am more inclined to point out the massive failures of humanity's attempt at Utopia by our own means. Book II has an entire "Forward By Oz Diggs" Prologue in which he sadly realizes all of those dreams led to hell on Earth during the 20th Century. I enjoyed having characters such as Aunt Em reacting to a before and after of an H-Bomb test: "Young man, where did that island go?" To which Jonathan replied, "Ma'am, that crater is now the island." Aunt Em classically replies, "My Lord, what hath man wrought."

I really enjoyed the scene in Book I where Glinda and the Book of Records have a conversation about the evil that has invaded Oz. In fact, I'll copy that:

It was getting late, but Glinda had two more items to

discuss and to follow their conclusions to the bitter truth.

Glinda: “We had very good intentions for the

enchantment of the magic barrier.”

Book: “See the Law of Unintended Consequences.”

Glinda: “Quick definition, please.”

Book: “A warning that an intervention in a complex

system tends to create unanticipated and often

undesirable outcomes.”

Glinda: “Examples?”

Book: “There are 16,777,216 examples currently on

record. Do you want me to start at 1?”

Glinda: “No. No... Could we have known?”

Book: “That in the year 1910 you would be discussing

this with me in the year 2030?”

Glinda: “No.....”

Book: “Because you are Glinda the Good, not Glinda

the Perfect.”

Glinda: “And Ozma?”

Book: “Ozma is the Rightful Ruler of Oz, not Ozma the

Omniscient.”

Glinda: “Conclusion?”

Book: “You both could not have known...”

It was a somber flight back to the Emerald City.

Chapter 29 of Book I lists a whole slew of evil that Ozma never saw through her Magic Picture and I was very brutal in naming names and situations: such as "Separate But Equal", the Tuskegee Syphilis Study, etc.

Book II really hammers home what happens when you have a society that has been magically provided for and the subjects start resenting when the simplest of ailments aren't healed. 

I don't have my Original Characters trying to overthrow the existing systems. Rather, they work within it. They provide different perspectives, and with the establishment of The Confederation of Kingdoms, based on the Iroquois Confederacy, Ozma understands that each Kingdom has its own unique set of traditions and laws and that they are equals.

After all, the Magic Barrier basically left all other Kingdoms outside of Oz proper to fend for themselves. As my character David Benjamin explained to Ozma, it was a de facto secession.

In my thoughts, I see Ix as being the technologically-advanced Kingdom. Oz is more agricultural -- in keeping with L. Frank Baum's original work. And magic use in Oz is officially limited. In Ix, only Queen Zixi practices it. In the upcoming Act 1 of Book III, an entire island of Native Americans will be magic users and will have developed schools and rules for its use.

I'm also going to say that not all societies will be the same (we know of the Phanfasm's and the Growleywogs. At least the surviving ones. ;)).

Act 2 of Book III will have an entire society ripped apart by the actions of one and will mirror our current issues in several areas.

8.) What other experience do you have with the fantasy and science fiction genre? I think I read that you wrote a science fiction-themed game.  

Ah yes, you are referring to the fanfiction novel, "From Neptune to Earth", which is based on the old arcade game Gyruss. A member of the Swiss Army, David Cuciz, and I co-wrote that and each chapter has two sections -- each from the point of view of his character and mine. Each chapter was a planet that our heroes had to fight to and overcome the enemy -- the Ideoclan Empire. One of the few reviews pointed out that our science was "hard" in regards to what each planet's system held. For example, the space around Jupiter is extremely radioactive and that played a major role in where and how long the fighting could last and its effects on the protagonists. The book is more along the lines of military science fiction with the science being as hard as we could get.

9.) What is your military background? How does it figure into your books?  

I am a retired Chief Warrant Officer Two from the South Carolina Army National Guard. Overall, I have about 23 years of total service -- active duty and reserve time. My first service was the US Coast Guard from July 24th, 1988, until March 15th, 1994. From July 1994 till 2006, I was a member of Bravo Company of the 112th Combat Engineers out of Brookpark and later Lorain, Ohio. From 2006 till 2007, I attended the state-run Warrant Officer Candidate School. (WOCS). I was at Fort Gordon from January 2008 until June 2008 for my IT school, and after a brief period back up in Ohio, we came back down South to the Charleston, South Carolina area. I finished my career as the Brigade S-6 IT Signal Warrant Officer for the 218th MEB -- which was two years of active duty.

The military is such a different way of life when compared to normal civilian occupations. I'm not surprised that many veterans often will join the police force or firefighters as something similar. The mindset, language, and attitudes can often seem to be entirely alien to those on the outside. I have always made a point to include that mindset in my books. When David Cuciz and I were writing "From Neptune to Earth", I was amazed at how much we had in common despite being from different countries. There is a commonality that those in the services possess which transcends countries. That is something I drew upon for Book I with the crew of the Haley and Lady Glinda's own Finest Forty. In a city of 50,000 people, Emerald City, it was only those two groups that ended up trusting and respecting each other.

I also tend to include people I have had the pleasure of serving with as characters in my books, and Book II was no exception as I used a good friend as the model for Jin the Giant Munchkin. Later books will do the same, including a group of Winkie volunteers becoming the first ever combat engineers of Oz. 

My service experiences have provided a fertile ground for stories and anecdotes in my writing. Just as has my faith in Yeshua is a part of me, so has this and I am humbled I can include it. As an example, a certain story about a water truck getting stuck always manages to find itself in my books. And in the final bantering scene of Book I, I included phrases that were used during my WOCS days.

10.) Have you noticed any changes in how audiences approach books now? 

I would have to guess that e-books and platforms such as Kindle have really opened up the options a consumer can have. I managed to get Book I into a Kindle format but it was a real chore to do so. Book II and "This Point in Time" are not available in Kindle. As for content, we can see how J.K. Rowling had children reading 700 or more page books. There is always a need for print, but having online sources is both good and bad as piracy of the text can be problematic.

Source: Amazon.com

Thank you for the interview, James. As we both know, we often close our Facebook chats with “Agape in Yeshua”, would you like to explain that to my audience? By the way, as I have thanked you, would you also like to explain our little inside joke about that in closing, my friend? 

James wrote back, “Certainly! Agape Love is the supreme, unconditional love. It is the love that God used when gave His Only Begotten Son. Yeshua is the Hebrew for Jesus. Combing the two, we get the phrase "Agape in Yeshua.

As for the inside joke, that is from Moana where Maui says ‘You're Welcome!’ “

Agape in Yeshua, James! Thanks again. I anticipate a certain Polynesian islander response soon!

If you are an author who has written an Oz book (I also do reviews) or who has written a Disney book or if you are an Oz or Disney fan and just want to be interviewed for this blog, contact Ron Baxley, Jr. at rbaxley37@gmail.com .  

Last week, I was given the honor of hosting a blogpost on the Top Ten Disney blog by Christopher Lucas (thank you very much again, Chris):
https://topdisneyblog.com/ron-baxleys-top-ten-disney-parks-experiences , and am reposting the text of the post here (the guest Top Disney blog has photos when you go there via the link, etc.):

Ron Baxley’s Top Ten Disney Parks Experiences

1. Alice in Wonderland dark ride at Disneyland – Though a life-long visitor to Walt Disney World for 40 years, I was only first able to visit Disneyland for the first time in 2015. I journeyed on the wonderful, glowing, and whimsical world that was the Alice in Wonderland dark ride. I laughed. I cried… well, almost. I nearly cried at the singing flowers because they brought back so many memories (even some of my late grandmother Hattie’s garden), and I, of course, laughed at the antics of the Cheshire Cat and the Mad Hatter and March Hare at the end. The over-the-top Red Queen never fails to please on screen or in person, and the dark ride treated me to one of her angrier scenes.
2. Peter Pan’s Flight – I have been on both the ones in Disneyland and Walt Disney World. I was petrified around age four on the one at the Magic Kingdom (I was also afraid of Captain Hook during a character greeting). In the miniature “flying” pirate ship in the dark ride, I was terrified of the heights but was also really hooked by the illusion created below. Returning to the one at Walt Disney World is always a joy. Going to the one at Disneyland for the first time in my forties truly made me feel young again.
3. Mr. Toad’s Wild Ride – I have been on both the now closed Florida one and the still open California one. I was afraid of the one at the Magic Kingdom a bit when I was young, because of the herky-jerky qualities of the ride (not to mention the horrific scenes toward the end) but grew to like it when I was a bit older. Seeing the one at Disneyland with its ornate statuary and props was quite the experience. It showed that Disneyland was still quaint in comparison to Walt Disney World yet had a lot more hands-on artistry behind it. One can really see Walt’s influence there and the creativity of his animators who were brought over to work on it.
4. Journey into Imagination at Epcot – Figment, the star of this ride, is up there with the original Elliot in my list of friendly Disney dragons. He was always one of my favorites since first visiting Epcot in 1983. As a child I really enjoyed the hands-on experiences at the Imagination Pavillion after Figment’s ride was over. It included digital drawing tools and touchless musical tools. Who can forget the iconic “One Little Spark of Imagination” song by the Sherman Brothers, either? I can still hear the chorus!
5. Big Thunder Mountain Railroad – I used to be scared of any type of roller coaster as a child, and this was one of the ones that weaned me from that fear. I liked the western theming of Thunder Mountain, with the desert hills and dried-out architecture. The dark tunnels were both frightening and exhilarating all at once. Later, I was able to see my niece enjoy this same ride and could even watch the fireworks while riding it with her and my sister during a visit. Seeing the colorful sparks and hearing the muffled booms in the distance while rushing down the track are experiences I will always treasure.
6. Country Bear Jamboree – I grew tired of country music because I grew up with it in the rural South. However, the Country Bear Jamboree always made me smile because of the parodies of country stars and just how comical they are. My favorite was always what I thought was an obvious Johnny Cash nod.
7. Dinosaur! at Animal Kingdom – I was a major fan of a certain other dinosaur franchise toward the middle of the 90s. Being able to experience the speed of a coaster with the thrill of dinosaurs come to life exhilarated me. As a science fiction fan, I always enjoyed the time travel plot too, so the theming of this ride really pulled me In.
8. The Haunted Mansion – Both of the U.S. Disney Haunted Mansions are different stylistically, but I love their shared bad puns, music, effects, and spooky/yet not too spooky atmosphere. The cobwebs, dust, and dank around the faux antiques, though making my allergic nose itch a bit, really contribute to the décor. The droll Cast members at each are to die for (pun intended.)
9. Animation Academy – I loved to draw cartoons and draw in general for many years and was pushed in another direction toward the end of high school. Before that, I liked to write and illustrate little stories. I continued with the writing and am now a published author. However, I never forgot the side of me that liked to draw. The Animation Academy, first at Disney-MGM Studios and then at Disney California Adventure, brought this side out again. I once made a wonderful depiction of Pluto there that I still have in my room.
10. Meeting Mickey Mouse – Just meeting Mickey Mouse is an iconic experience that makes me beam and tear up a little each time I do it. My late father made Walt Disney World a part of our lives for quite a few years, and seeing Mickey reminds me of him and years of wonderful experiences with family and friends at Walt Disney World.

Welcome to Disney, Baxley, and Oz! As a Disney fan, travel specialist, and Oz author, author in general, and fan, I, Ron Baxley, Jr., hope to have many amazing periodic posts about the aforementioned topics here, including my going past 27 years as a published author. I also hope to have posts about my Disney-related travels. Oz festival adventures, and trips to cons as well. (By the way, if you are interested in booking any Disney-related trip with me, contact me at ron@madhatteradv.com .)

I am leading off my postings with a huge exclusive interview which was going to be divided into smaller interviews for a Disney blog of which I was a group of contributors and may still contribute to from time to time. However, I decided to start this new blog with this gigantic interview of over 60 questions and am honored to have a great Disney author to interview.

Caption: Chris Lucas, Disney expert and author of Top Disney: 100 Top Ten Lists of the Best of Disney, from Man to the Mouse and Beyond (to be released by Lyons Press in April of this year), is shown with Timon from “The Lion King” at Animal Kingdom at Walt Disney World in Kissimmee, Florida recently. Photo contributed by author.

Disney, Baxley, and Oz welcomes Christopher Lucas, an expert with at least 30 years of experience with Disney, who has a book which will be in stores in April but is available now for pre-sale at Amazon, “Top Disney: 100 Top Ten Lists of the Best of Disney, from Man to the Mouse and Beyond” (Lyons Press).

  

Cover of Mr. Lucas’ extensive reference book on which this interview is focused. Photo courtesy of author.

Before beginning the interview, we would like to share Mr. Lucas’ bio. to give a better perspective on his background with Disney:

Christopher Lucas, is an actor, author, motivational speaker and a lifelong fan of all things Disney. His admiration for Walt led Christopher to create a one person show about Disney called “Of Mouse and Man,” which has been performed in schools, theaters, museums and other venues around the country since 2001. 

He is also the co‐author of Seeing Home: The Ed Lucas Story, the critically acclaimed best-selling book about his father released by Simon & Schuster and Derek Jeter Publishing in April 2015. 

A professional actor for over thirty years, Christopher has been seen on the big screen and in television shows in featured, supporting, and recurring roles. As such, he's been profiled in People Magazine, USA Today, Newsweek, Soap Opera Weekly, the New York Times and several other national publications. 

The father of two teenage boys, Christopher promises to one day take them on a vacation that doesn't involve a visit to a Disney park. He can be reached at MouseTopTen@Gmail.com.

Christopher Lucas, author of “Top Disney: The Best of the Man, the Mouse, and the Magic Kingdom”, is shown at Disney’s California Adventure several years ago. Photo contributed by author.

1) What made you want to write this book? 

One of the big questions you ask yourself when setting out to write a book about a subject like Disney, where there already already thousands of titles to choose from, is “what do I have to say about it that’s original?” In this case, I discovered that nobody had really put together a compilation of top ten lists covering the entire history of Disney as a whole, so I made it my mission, beginning in 2001. Dave Smith, the founder of the Disney Archives, told me that he’d thought about such a project himself years ago, but never got around to it. If he had, I wouldn’t have written mine. I was happy to get his blessing on this project.

Note: The late Dave Rollin Smith died on Feb. 15 of this year after this interview was conducted. 

Graphic contributed by Christopher Lucas

2) What makes this book different than other guides to the Disney Studios and their work?  

While most guides focus on a particular area of Disney, mine tries to cover the whole company, from Walt’s personal history to the media assets and the parks and beyond. That’s a lot to put in one book and, hopefully, it lends itself to repeated reading.  

3) Why do you think it was necessary to compile lists of Disney information? 

Whenever I go to Disney gatherings, or just have casual conversations with Disney fans, we often wind up listing and debating our favorites, just out of habit. I thought it might be fun to compile some of these lists, as a jumping off point for future conversations about the best of Disney.  

Note: Christopher Lucas had been working on this project for at least 17 years before acceptance for publication and had an endorsement from the late, long-time friend of Walt Disney and Disney collaborator Art Linkletter for it over a decade ago. Linkletter, among many accomplishments as a media personality, was well-known as the emcee for the live broadcast by ABC of Disneyland’s opening day on July 17, 1955 which was also broadcasted nationally on a Sunday. Graphic contributed by author.

4) How did you exclude certain film titles from your lists and why?

It wasn’t easy, I can tell you that. While some personal favorites made it to my lists, I tried my best to weigh the lists with consensus choices from critics, experts and fans. In some cases, the lists came together without much wavering; in others, it was harder to narrow down to ten.   

5) I knew there was some Disney connection to the Kissimmee, Florida area decades before Walt Disney was eyeing the property there. I did not know specifically that his father and mother lived there. How did you find that out? I had read somewhere or heard from a Disney source somewhere that a postal employee from the Kissimmee area had some connection to Walt Disney, but perhaps I was mistaken. Is there any validity to that? 

Most of the information about Walt himself in my book comes from three sources, Disney A to Z by Dave Smith, and the biographies of Walt by Bob Thomas and Neal Gabler. Dave Smith and the Disney Archives confirmed a lot of the more obscure bits of information. Disney experts like Jim Korkis, Jim Hill and Didier Ghez also have contributed greatly to the Disney history cited in the book.

Walt’s parents – Elias and Flora -  lived in Acron, Florida, a town that doesn’t exist anymore. It’s about 30 miles north of Walt Disney World, close to where Clermont is now, part of the greater Kissimmee area. They ran a cattle farm, orange grove and bed and breakfast. None of these ventures worked out (ironic since the resort their sons built almost 100 years later is now the busiest tourist destination in the world.) Walt’s uncle and brother were both postal workers, as was Walt for a time, and parts of Flora’s family remained in Florida, so it’s possible other distant family members might have gone into the profession but I can’t confirm that.  

6) I knew Disney had tried to build a resort area in the Sierra Nevada Mountains but was shot down from environmental groups from what I read. I did not know that he had planned to build a theme-park in Marceline, Missouri, where he spent a large part of his childhood. Where did you read this or how did you find out about it?  Does the Walt Disney Hometown Museum there have information about it? 

Yes, the Hometown Museum in Marceline has information about the proposed farmland museum/theme park there, which would have been like a Midwest turn of the 20^th Century version of Colonial Williamsburg. Even without the unbuilt park, Marceline is still an amazing place to visit for fans of Disney history.   

(Left and Above) Some of the many displays at the Walt Disney Hometown Museum. Photos contributed by Christopher Lucas

7) You mention in the biographical section about Walt about his not liking critics. I had read that elsewhere too. Why do you think this was? 

I won’t presume to speak directly for Walt, but almost every quote he gave about critics implied that he didn’t hold much value in their opinions. He respected them professionally and as people, but preferred to hear from the folks who actually paid to see his movies and bought Disney products. He responded to the public’s suggestions faster than those from critics. One of my favorite quotes was when a critic called Disney films “corny” and Walt said, “So what? I happen to like corn!”

8) I knew about Walt's and Lilly's daughter Sharon and, of course, first-born Diane, but I did not know Sharon was adopted. (I may have read it and forgot it through time.) Was this common knowledge? Why was she adopted? Was Lilly unable to have a second child? Was the adoption for charitable reasons? 

Lilly experienced several miscarriages and was advised to not have any more children after the birth of Diane. Nevertheless, Walt and Lilly wanted Diane to have a sibling. At the time Sharon joined the family, there was still a bit of a stigma in society about adoption and adoptees. Walt and Lilly tried hard to protect Sharon from that, guarding her privacy. They never denied her adoption, or made her feel like she wasn’t wholly a Disney, but they also didn’t speak openly about it. 

9) I knew The Golden Horseshoe at Frontierland was of great importance to Walt and Lilly and knew how much they liked to go there, but I had forgotten about their 30th Wedding Anniversary there until I was reminded of it by your book. Was that what always made that place so special to the two of them or were they also enamored with the time period of the Old West?  

It wasn’t so much the Old West that Walt loved, it was just a nostalgia for the simpler days of America – before the advent of the Twentieth Century – when the world moved a bit slower and entertainment was on a more intimate level, with showrooms and dining halls. The Golden Horseshoe was his homage to such places on the frontier, where settlers would be treated to a variety of acts, from showgirls to Shakespeare. Though he lived in the Midwest, Walt got to see many of these traveling acts in person before they headed out to the frontier by rail or wagon. Walt – who ate there as often as he could - had a favorite stage side box at the Golden Horseshoe, people can still there enjoying a meal and occasional show.

(Top, modern Golden Horseshoe Review; Bottom, anniversary gift from Walt to Lillian and couple shown at Golden Horseshoe Review)

Photos contributed by: Christopher Lucas

 10) I knew about some of the influences of New Orleans Square by Walt and Lilly's travels, and I knew Walt had found a small mechanical bird in a cage which inspired the Tiki Room birds and other audio-animatronic figures. However, I did not know that he found the bird in New Orleans. Where did you find this research? 

The Walt Disney Family Museum has an exhibit about the evolution of audio-animatronics, including the original New Orleans bird in the cage. The story also been mentioned in books by Thomas and Korkis, among others. 

 Snip-it of photo from digital page in Top Disney. -Used with permission of author.

11) I always heard the stories about Walt having different individuals secretly buy up land in central Florida for his proposed Walt Disney World. I did not know that a reporter, Ms. Bavar, broke the story, not through investigation into these sales but through directly confronting Walt and saying he was the buyer. She found out he knew too much about the area, according to your book, and “methinks he doth protest too much” came to mind. How did you discover how she retrieved the information?  

There’s a great book called “Project Future” which has a comprehensive history of the events leading up to the creation of Walt Disney World. Emily Bavar’s story, and her amazing journalistic tenacity, is chronicled there in detail. 

12) I had ready many of the direct quotes from Walt, but I had never read this one: 

“Animation can explain whatever the mind of man can conceive. This facility makes it the most versatile and explicit means of communication yet devised for quick mass appreciation.”? What was the context of this quote?

He was addressing an audience of admirers at an awards ceremony in Hollywood in the early 1960s, where they were specifically honoring him for his accomplishments as a pioneer in the field of animation.  

13) How did you research the bibliography of over 10 books about Walt? How about the listing of 11 films about him/his life? Where did you research that? What basically helps you decide what “makes the cut”? 

Most of the books and films listed in my book were already in my personal library, so I was familiar with them and had read and re-read them. This was one of the toughest lists to compile, as there are so many books and films about Disney. The ones that made the cut either broke new ground on the subject or were so illuminating that they couldn’t be left out. Even so, those lists could have included more than 25 entries and still have been just scratching the surface.    

14) There were at least 8 people I did not know who you listed were experts on Disney’s life. I did not know them despite having read a lot of books and articles about Disney and the studio (sometimes, I am bad with names). I hesitate to state which ones I did not for fear of offending them, but I did know one prestigious critic, one animator, perhaps one other individual, and one you listed as an Honorable Mention who is a Facebook friend and who I have interviewed before for Disney Avenue, David Skipper. Have you met all of these experts in person? How many of them were interviewed for your book?  

I’ve not met all of them, but have been in direct contact with most of the experts listed in my book.

15) Of your places to visit listing, the only one I did not know was The Tam O'Shanter, but I may have read about it in passing somewhere. Summarize for my readers its significance. 

The Tam O'Shanter is one of the oldest restaurants in Los Angeles. It was close to Walt’s various studios and homes, so he and his animators often ate there. The menu appealed to Walt’s simple tastes (steak and potatoes.) The look of the restaurant and its staff also influenced Walt in that the small cottage design showed up in several cartoon shorts and films like Snow White and Pinocchio and the tartan uniform inspired similar outfits for Disneyland cast members. The restaurant still has the table where Walt sat, and illustrations and photos from Walt and his staff on the walls. Every true Disney fan should eat there at least once.   

Two above photos from Tam O'Shanters contributed by Christopher Lucas

16) I was well-aware of everything in your extensive summary of the history of the Walt Disney Company from previous readings and viewings of specials and films about the studio. You did a great job on that summary. However, given Michael Eisner’s controversial aspects, as discussed in the James B. Stewart’s book “Disney War”, for example, I am surprised you did not mention those. Why did you not discuss Eisner’s controversial aspects when you did discuss other controversies such as the one in early Disney history with Mintz over Oswald the Rabbit?

My style as a writer is to keep things upbeat and not to dish dirt, even if it is verified and documented dirt. Walt’s situation with Mintz and Oswald happened ninety years ago, so nobody will be offended if they are cast in an unflattering light. With people who were around during Eisner’s tenure, however, the case is different. I didn’t get into any of those issues because they weren’t necessary in telling the story. Eisner had hits and misses during his time, as did Walt, Bob Iger and others. I gave the facts as they were, but tried not to drift into personal opinions or speculation. I cover some of the blemishes on the Disney Company’s reputation (the 1940 strike, almost falling prey to corporate raiders, etc.) but for the most part the book is a valentine to Walt and the culture he created.

SnipIt of illustration from Top Disney.  Used with permission of author.

17) I understand many of the classic characters (the Fab Five of Disney and characters from early studio films) and even a few of the renaissance characters from the 90s making your list of Top 10 iconic Disney characters and even Jack Sparrow as a modern one given his film and Disney Parks influence as a character. (He has even been put as an audio-animatronic figure into the iconic “Pirates of the Caribbean” dark rides at the Disney Parks.) However, why put Hannah Montana in that list? Perhaps some might see her as more of a footnote of the new millennium. 

Disney’s biggest profit stream still comes from their many television networks and on demand services. There’s no way that’s the case without Hannah Montana. She may be a footnote to future generations, but many kids today couldn’t tell you who Annette Funicello was, even though she had a big impact on Disney’s bottom line in the 1950s and 60s. Hannah Montana was the early 21^st Century version of Annette (though Miley Cyrus did not follow Funicello’s pattern of consulting Disney before making career moves that might tarnish her wholesome image.) The Hannah Montana character and TV show accounted for billions in merchandise and album sales. She was everywhere for years and was the gateway to music for many kids of that era. Hannah Montana also lifted the fortunes of Radio Disney, which was struggling, and the Disney Channel, which saw rapid expansion, leading to even more billion dollar franchises like High School Musical, Phineas & Ferb and The Descendants. That’s why I felt she was worthy of inclusion.

SnipIt of photo from Top Disney. Used with permission of author.

18) I was looking at your list of Disney CEOs and their small bios. I knew quite a few from past readings but a few seemed obscure. Do you think CEOs can be like presidents of a country with some being more memorable? Why/why not?

That’s an excellent analogy. If you ask people to name U.S. Presidents off the top of their heads, they will go to the big ones, like Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, Roosevelt, Kennedy, etc. and completely skip over ones like Van Buren, Polk, Cleveland, Coolidge and Taft. It’s not that those guys didn’t do a good job, it’s that they mostly kept the ship afloat and didn’t move the rudder in a big direction, one way or the other. The same holds true with CEOs. It’s the ones who make bold moves that the public knows best.

19) As per your section on the classic animators and on “The Nine Old Men” animators of Disney, though I knew of the others, my favorite was Ward Kimball because of his personality and animation style. Ub Iwerks was very familiar to me as a historical figure connected to Walt and the studio’s early beginnings. Some of the other animators’ names, save for Mary Blair and Freddie Moore, did not stand out to me as much. Do you think more of an emphasis in Disney history and pop culture has been placed on “The Nine Old Men,” Ub Iwerks, Mary Blair, Freddie Moore, and a few others versus your list of about 20 total? Why/why not?

A lot of it has to do with all of the early productions having the name “Walt Disney” on the title card. Animators and artists were largely unknown to the public in the beginning; it was the studio or director’s name that got the attention. This was one of the underlying causes of the 1940 strike, some animations felt unappreciated. That started to change in the era of television, when individual animators (and voice-over actors) became brands unto themselves. Increased curiosity about the Disney studio led to more attention for the core of animators and artists who remained (like The Nine Old Men) to work on the films, TV shows and Disneyland attractions but some of the others who’d departed the studio were forgotten. Thankfully, more and more is being written about these previously unheralded men and women, so they are finally getting their due.  

   

SnipIt of photo from Top Disney. Used with permission of author

20) As per the animators from your modern era section, Mark Dindal was one who I was not familiar with. Was he a stand-out? Why/why not? I did not see Don Bluth mentioned. Didn’t he start at Disney Studios before starting his own note-worthy animation company and even revolutionary animated arcade games? (There are so many other lists involving films about the animators and people who were not given enough recognition (by others, not you) that I cannot possibly address all of them with summary questions. The resource you have created if quite exhaustive, thorough, and excellent.)

There are many lists I would have liked to include in the book, but I had to cut them to get to 100. One of the ones I hated to lose was “Artists whose careers began at Disney.” That list would have included Walt Kelly, Chuck Jones, Bill Melendez, Tim Burton, and – yes – Don Bluth. As for Mark Dindal, he is one of those people who had a hand in many of the classic animated films people love, from 1980 until the 2000s, yet isn’t a household name. He bridged the gap from the retirement of the Nine Old Men until today’s computer generated animation (His “Chicken Little” is an underrated film, in my opinion.) Because of his longevity, and his influence on today’s young animators, I felt he deserved inclusion. It’s people like Mark Dindal who inspired me to write this book, to shed light on folks who were crucial in Disney history, but who don’t get as much credit as they should.   

21) Of the many Disney animated films (musical and non-musical) and live action, non-musical classic films you mentioned early on in the book, the few ones I have never seen included part of Kurt Russell’s Dexter Riley series: “Now You See Him, Now You Don’t” (1972) and “The Strongest Man in the World” (1975). I was born in 1975 and saw most every Disney film and short from the late 1920s on forward via the aforementioned methods. Why do you think I may have missed those two sequels on satellite television or VHS? Were they popular? I actually vaguely remember seeing “The Computer Wore Tennis Shoes” (1969) and Russell’s character coming across as a know-it-all. Were the sequels as successful as the original? Why/why not? I read something somewhere that toward the middle of the 70s that the studio was really in trouble and that outside interests were trying to control it/ buy it out. Do you think this affected the quality of these sequels? How about other films of that period?  

“The Love Bug” was the biggest film of 1969, so Disney’s live action division was in good shape going into the 1970s. Kurt Russell was a bankable star for them, and they continued making films featuring his character, Dexter Riley. They did well, too. Somewhere around the mid 1970s, Hollywood started to change. Directors became more powerful than the studios, making their own deals and calling the shots. The contract player system started dissolving, and edgier and more thrilling films (like “The Exorcist”, “The Godfather”, and “Jaws”) dominated the box office. Disney passed on “Star Wars” and other films that might have gotten them into that new blockbuster game. Their live action films were still good, just not what audiences were looking for. Ron Miller made shrewd decisions to bring the studio in line with the times, but the change came too late to save his job. By the time Disney got their footing back, by establishing Touchstone Pictures, Miller had been moved aside and Kurt Russell had already become an international blockbuster superstar with films for other studios. His Dexter Riley films were overlooked by fans for years in favor of his 1980s action-adventure movies.   

22) I take that back about seeing every classic Disney animated short. I’ve never seen the following you mentioned in one of your lists in the book: “TOMMY TUCKER’S TOOTH (1921) Made by Walt for a dentist in Kansas City, it was the first Disney educational film… or THE FOUR METHODS OF FLUSH RIVETING (1942) Walt’s test to see whether the military would accept Disney versions of training films.” 

Though one was a very early film Walt made in Kansas City and the other was a military training film, are they available for viewing anywhere? Have you seen them?

Both films are actually available to view on YouTube.

23) These were two, modern Hollywood Pictures films (under ownership of Disney) that I had never seen as shown in your book: 

“CRIMSON TIDE (1995) directed by Tony Scott A blockbuster film, with Gene Hackman and Denzel Washington co-starring as naval commanders facing off in a battle for control of a nuclear submarine during a crisis. THE ROCK (1996) directed by Michael Bay Another blockbuster, this time with Nicolas Cage trying to stop rogue Army personnel from launching a deadly nerve gas attack on San Francisco from their base on Alcatraz Island.” 

Many of the films done under these other brand names for want of a better term, were great departures for Disney, weren’t they? Why do you think this was?  

Ron Miller, Walt’s son-in-law, said that after they watched “To Kill a Mockingbird” together, Walt lamented that Disney couldn’t make a film like that – as great as it was - because it didn’t fit what people expected of a Disney movie. Miller used that thinking when he established Touchstone Pictures in the early 1980s, to give Disney an arm to release such “un-Disney” films. Hollywood Pictures was a second extension of that. For the most part, people have now accepted that Disney films can be darker, with deeper themes. Still, there has yet to be a film with the world “Disney” in the production banner to be rated R. (And Disney is also the only Hollywood studio left from the golden age to never have won Best Picture at the Oscars. The two might be related.)  

24) Looking over the list of Disney/ Pixar films, I have loved many of them. The “Cars” films did not always appeal to me, but I have friends with children who loved them and loved watching them with their young kids. Do you think they had the appeal of the characters and story development that the other Pixar films had? Why/why not? Do you think there is a way to further sub-categorize Pixar films into categories of even more juvenile interest versus more cross-family appeal? Where would you categorize “Inside Out” for example if you created sub-categories of Pixar films?

Pixar was another difficult subject for me to approach in the book, because it started as an independent studio but is now part of the Disney family. I didn’t, for instance, include any Pixar shorts in my list of Disney shorts. Some Pixar films are pure masterpieces, and some are just pure entertainment; some – like “Inside Out,” “Wall-E,” and “Toy Story 3” - are a combination of both. They all have merit, and could certainly be broken into sub-lists. “Cars” had great appeal because it was Pixar’s spin on certain movie tropes. It was a buddy comedy with heart, but also about the slick know it all character who realizes – after a dose of small town living – that he really doesn’t know it all. Disney certainly got what they wanted from the film, with memorable characters who will stand the test of time.

25) Despite watching a lot of classic Disney films on The Disney Channel in the 80s and in other ways, I had never seen these Disney westerns from your one of your listings: 

“TONKA (1958) directed by Lewis R. Foster The tale of a wild stallion, Tonka, who is tamed by a young Native American boy, taken by the U.S. Cavalry to ride for them in the Battle of the Little Bighorn, and then reunited with his master. THE ADVENTURES OF BULLWHIP GRIFFIN(1967) directed by James Neilson A stuffy British butler (Roddy McDowall) is mistaken for a rowdy boxer in this western comedy. SCANDALOUS JOHN (1971) directed by Robert Butler A modern rancher who fancies himself a cowboy hero goes on one last cattle drive with his portly Mexican companion to stop a greedy land tycoon. Loosely based on Don Quixote.” 

Do you think that is more to do with my having been born in the mid-70s and a childhood that extended through the 80s where interest had waned in westerns and continued to wane? (The Buzz versus Woody phenomenon if you will) I do not recall some of those titles even being on The Disney Channel alongside such fare as “Davy Crockett” for example.

The films you mentioned were buried in the Disney vaults for decades, not because they weren’t good but because – as you point out – it was hard to market westerns in the 1980s and 90s. They are being rediscovered now, and I hope they will be made available on the new Disney+ streaming service.   

26) Though I love science fiction and classic films, of your listing of live action Disney science fiction films, I have never seen the following: MOON PILOT (1962) directed by James Neilson An alien girl falls in love with a U.S. astronaut in Disney’s first outer space feature film. 

Is it fairly obscure? Where can one find it?

Though it is a little known Disney film, “Moon Pilot” was available for a time on VHS and DVD. It can be found online as well.  

27) Another obscure one in the super hero film genre I had never seen, though I really enjoy comic book films, was the following: “CONDORMAN (1981) directed by Charles Jarrott A worthy entry into the comic book genre, this mostly forgotten Disney film stars Michael Crawford as the title character, a comic book artist and inventor who gets mixed up with spies and has to pretend to be a superhero. Filmed all over Europe, with beautiful cinematography, cool cars, and incredible gadgets.” Have you seen it and how was it?

I loved “Condorman” when I saw it the year it was released in theaters. This was Disney’s answer to both Superman and James Bond, franchises that had folks lining up at the box office at that time. Unfortunately, it never captured the audience like the other films did. It all but vanished by the time the whole superhero genre started to explode in the late 1980s with Tim Burton’s “Batman” but is still worth watching.

Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

  

28) It’s amazing that though I was born in the mid-seventies and had access to older films than the 80s in the early 80s Disney Channel and on VHS that I had never seen the following Disney sports-themed film: 

“THE WORLD’S GREATEST ATHLETE (1973) directed by Robert Scheerer Disney’s first pure sports movie, a “fish out of water” slapstick comedy about a missionary’s kid from Africa being recruited to compete in NCAA decathlon events in Los Angeles.”

How was this film? -Any thoughts? Were there any stereo-types within this film?

It’s good film, but definitely one that’s dated. Some of the jokes and situations used in 1973 might cause a bit of cringing in 2018, but it’s another one worth watching.  

29) I have seen many of the live-action nature films by Disney on their channel and elsewhere – the ones in your listing. Did ecologists / biologists become hyper-critical of, for example, these two films from your list (the only ones of this type I had not seen): “…PERRI (1957) directed by N. Paul Kenworthy Jr. and Ralph Wright Walt’s weirdest live-action nature film, based on a story by Felix Salten, the author of Bambi. While it uses scenes shot in the wild, the footage was edited and manipulated to tell a scripted story about a brave squirrel who protects his home from predators and falls in love… 

THE INCREDIBLE JOURNEY (1963) directed by Fletcher Markle Not a pure nature film like the others, this movie actually has human actors in it. It’s the story of two dogs and a cat who travel 200 miles across Canada together looking for their owners. Remade by Disney in the 1990s. ..NEVER CRY WOLF (1983) directed by Carol Ballard Charles Martin Smith plays an intrepid scientist sent into the frozen tundra by the Canadian government to study a pack of wolves that seem to be killing off the caribou there. During the course of his work, he bonds with the innocent wolves and becomes part of their pack”?

“Perri” absolutely received criticism, because Disney manipulated natural shots of animals to tell a fictional story (even though they were doing the same thing in their nature documentaries.) No animals were harmed, of course, but it was the one and only time they attempted such a project. “The Incredible Journey” was well received, and “Never Cry Wolf” was one of the films that Ron Miller developed which moved Disney closer to the more serious subject matter. That one was the first be released under the banner of “Walt Disney Pictures” and won several awards from critics and film professional groups.

 Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

30) Though I like musicals, as per that listing, I have only seen “Evita” in its entirety recently. Of great note is that Tim Rice co-wrote it with Sir Andrew Lloyd Webber. Explain the chicken and egg scenario with Rice’s work on this and then on Disney animated scores. Which came first, the chicken or the egg, in this case?

The chicken definitely came first, as Sir Tim Rice’s reputation was well established before Disney came calling. It was Disney’s return to Broadway style animated musicals in the 1990s that helped to draw major talent like Tim Rice to their company.

31) Was “Step Up,” the Buena Vista release in the musical category, a lot like “Fame”?

“Step Up” is a quasi-musical. It only made the modern live action musical list (and just barely) because Disney hadn’t made many live action musicals in the modern era before this book was completed at the end of 2017. In the next edition, “Step Up” will definitely fall off the list to be replaced by one of the newer live action entries like “Mary Poppins Returns”, “Aladdin”, and “Mulan.”   

32) The songs from Disney classics listings were all recognized by me. Wasn’t “The Lord is Good to Me” used in the Johnny Appleseed part of “Melody Time”? If not, where was it used?

It was, and that’s how most people know it. In fact, my son’s grammar school used that segment to help teach the kids about Johnny Appleseed. 

33) “Feed the Birds” was given a Special Mention by you, which I understand is much better than an Honorable Mention. I agree that this Sherman Brothers classic from “Mary Poppins,” a song that was so beloved by Walt, deserved a Special Mention. Does the song hold any special meaning to you personally?

I share the same affinity for the song as Walt did, for the same reason. It’s a simple song that delivers a powerful message – it doesn’t take much to show kindness to your fellow man, rather than being so wrapped up in yourself that you ignore the concerns of those around you. “Feed the birds, tuppence a bag…”

34) The only modern song you listed that does not stick out in my head and that I cannot hum or sing is “If I Didn’t Have You” from Monsters, Inc. Why did this make your list? (I did go back and listen to the song on YouTube and did remember it after I had already asked this question. It is fun and reminds me of an old Vaudeville routine coupled with modern jazzy songs. Lucas’ book does, indeed, serve to provide reminders of the vast universe that is Disney.)

One of the main reasons this song made the list is that it marked Randy Newman’s first ever Oscar victory, after coming close many, many times. For a lot of the lists in the book, a key tie breaker was “did it win an Oscar or break records?” In this case, “If I Didn’t Have You” did. It’s also a fun, bouncy, jazzy song.  

35) I was well-aware of all of your soundtrack mentions. Then, I arrived at the Underrated Disney Films and thought I might not know some of those. I may have seen “Johnny Tremain” on Disney Channel in the 80s at some point (but cannot remember) as well as perhaps the equally obscure or underrated “Scarecrow of Romney Marsh” (is it mentioned in the book?... I think it might be under a different title) I knew and had seen all the other underrated ones, including “Midnight Madness.” I saw it when I was a kid on the satellite and have been trying to find it on VHS or DVD ever since. I liked the scavenger hunt aspects of it and the funny clues throughout, but I had less discerning tastes as a young kid. I remember Michael J. Fox was in it in a quite early role. Is it still available to buy? I had no idea it was a Disney film. I still remember there being a red herring on the scavenger hunt that involved melons, but I cannot discuss it for a family audience. How did you figure out it was if Disney did not attach its name to the film? What source did you use?

There’s been debate over the years about “Midnight Madness” and whether it was Disney’s first PG film, a title that is officially claimed by “The Black Hole.” According to many film historians, Disney didn’t know what to do with “Madness” so it sat on a shelf for a while until finally being released by Buena Vista, a few weeks after “The Black Hole.” Paul Reubens (Pee Wee Herman) John Fielder (voice of Piglet) and Dirk Blocker from “Brooklyn 99” also make appearances.

36) I know I did not see the “health film” you had listed or even the war training film in your “Most Unusual Film” listing. Those do not need a lot of explanation, but tell me about the more Disney-esque of the following two, “Bon Voyage”, and the least Disney-esque, “Miracle of the White Stallions.” How do they compare as being Disney films? How do they differ? “Trenchcoat” was another one from this list I had never heard of. What makes it so non-Disney-esque versus Disney-esque?

It’s hard to qualify what is a “non-Disney-esque” film. That is in the eyes of the beholder. Some things, like cursing or nudity, are obvious. Some, like theming and situations, are a little fuzzier. “Trenchcoat” is one of those films that falls in the grey area; it’s too tame to compete with edgy adult films, but too mature (violence, murder, espionage) to have appeal to kids. That’s why Disney had no idea what to do with it. (A few years later it would have been released as a Touchstone film.)   

Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

37) All the animated leading men and ladies were very familiar to me, and I agreed with all of your choices. As per the villains, I do not know how I did not know this, but I never knew the old hag version of the Evil Queen had a name, Queen Grimhilde. How did you find his out? All the other Disney female and male villain names were very familiar to me. 

Walt saw a traveling stage production of “Snow White” as a child, which stayed with him. In that version, the Queen was known as Grimhilde. He used that name when describing the story to his animators. She was called Grimhilde in internal memos and script notes, as well as in some Disney comics, but never on screen. In recent years, Disney has used the name officially in several media properties.  

38) The live action leading men and lady lists were all well-known to me. I knew most of the male and female live action villains too save for one. Tell me about Carla Santini from “Confessions of a Teenaged Drama Queen.” I was not aware of this villain. Do mostly millennials know her? 

Megan Fox played Carla in the 2004 film “Confessions of a Teenage Drama Queen.” She was the stereotypical mean bully girl who antagonizes and ostracizes Lindsay Lohan’s character. This was Disney, so the story never got too mean, but Fox played the role to perfection, making Carla – who eventually gets her comeuppance - one of the most memorable modern Disney live action villains.

39) The Disney side-kicks lists were delightful! I remembered all of them save for Philoctetes because I became so used to the satyr being called by his nick-name “Phil” in “Hercules” that I had forgotten the longer Greek name. I do not remember his full name being used much in the film. Was the full name used at least once in the film – perhaps when he introduced himself?  

The name was used a few times in the film, but Danny DeVito, who voiced him, preferred to call him “Phil.”

40) I knew all the Disney canines from your list. But I did not know one of the felines, Julius, from the 1920s Alice shorts. Explain his role in those shorts and the significance of those shorts in general.   

Before there was a Disney Studio, Walt had a company called Laugh-O-Gram films. The most popular cartoon character in the world at the time was Felix the Cat. Walt’s Laugh-O-Gram distributor urged him to come up with his own cat, and Julius was born. At first, the little cat didn’t have a name. He was used as a comedy sidekick for the live action Alice in early Disney shorts. Then, Walt christened him Julius, and he is officially credited as the first Disney named character, appearing in 47 shorts. Julius even got to battle Pete, Disney’s first named villain, years before Mickey did. Criticism of Julius as just another Felix clone caused Walt to drop him by 1927, in favor of newer characters. Two stores in Disney’s California Adventure are named for Julius the Cat.

Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

41) As per the Disney critters list, I knew about the raccoon from “Pocahontas” but had forgotten he was called Meeko. How many times do you think that happens with a character, remembering details but not remembering the name? Do you think your book facilitates people re-grasping lost knowledge?

It’s another of the reasons I wrote the book, to re-introduce some characters to the public, and refresh memories about details like names.  

42) The couples in the couples list were all very memorable to me. The Disney Duos list duos were too. The trios list would have been well-remembered by me too were it not for three hyenas from “The Lion King.” I remembered Ed’s name perhaps being used in the film, but I did not remember Shenzi and Banzai of the main hyena trio being called by their names. Why do you think they did not stand out to me? All of the Disney groups listing were very memorable to me as well, by the way.

Ed’s name is mentioned in the film more often than Shenzi and Banzai because he is largely mute, so they refer to him again and again by name for exposition purposes. In some cartoons based on “The Lion King”, they do use all three names. “The Lion King” is so full of rich and powerful characters that the hyenas are easily lost in the shuffle.

43)  As per underrated Disney characters, I did not know about Oswald until I was at least in my late twenties or early thirties, and I am in my forties now. Not much was stated about the loss of the character – even up until the 70s and 80s when I was a kid and even well through the nineties (and may even part of the new millennium). Explain why.

Oswald was almost like an orphan character for decades. Universal had the rights to him, so Disney never really mentioned him. Historians and journalists would bring Oswald’s name up in stories about the early days of Disney, but it wasn’t until Disney got back the rights to Oswald in 2006 (in a swap for broadcaster Al Michaels, one of the craziest trades in entertainment history) that the public paid attention to him again.

44) I knew a lot about Uncle Remus from excerpts from scenes from “Song of the South” that used to be played on early 80s Disney Channel and from some mentions of him by my Southern family members. I have only ever been able to see excerpts from the film, though, because of its lack of availability / it being sealed in the Disney vault permanently so to speak. You have Uncle Remus listed as an underrated Disney character, but with the censorship of “Song of the South”, do you think it’s more like he is intentionally unremembered? Why/why not? Disneyland and Walt Disney World’s Magic Kingdom both have Splash Mountain attractions that use the animal characters Uncle Remus discussed (or that author Joel Chandler Harris had discuss) in his tales. However, one will not find Uncle Remus there or mentions of the film. Do you care to discuss this? Why do you think this is?

Walt loved the Uncle Remus stories by Joel Chandler Harris and fought hard to bring them to the screen. James Baskett played the role of Uncle Remus brilliantly. Even in Walt’s time, however, there was some backlash to “Song of The South.” Walt was stung by the criticism, but also encouraged the Academy to give Baskett an Oscar for his work, one of the first African-Americans to receive the honor. The film was re-released in theaters, on television and on home video for years until the tide started to turn against it in the late 1980s. It’s become too much of a hot button issue now for Disney to touch (though much of the criticism comes from people who’ve never actually seen the film.) Ironically, Splash Mountain is one of the most popular theme park attractions, even though it’s based on the film Disney has hidden. Baskett’s vocal interpretations of the characters are the basis for the audio-animatronics on the ride, though Uncle Remus himself does not appear. That’s a shame, because Baskett deserves more attention.    

   James Baskett receiving an Oscar for his work in “The Song of the South” (Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas)

45) Because of my having the Disney Channel in the very early 80s, I was well-aware of all of your listing of forgotten Disney characters (and, yes, they are forgotten to many for the most part). However, one I was not aware of was Clara Cluck. Explain about her. (I later recalled seeing her after seeing the submitted photo of her after the interview.) State one or two other of the most obscure ones our audience may not know and give a one sentence description of them.  

Clara was a parody of the faux operatic musical stye of the 1930s. She was supposed to be a one-off character in a Mickey short, but became so popular that she began recurring in other shorts, crossing over to Donald Duck’s universe, too. She’s often portrayed as a stuffy, high society dowager type. She’s obscure, but known just enough to have made appearances in the parks and in parades.

Photo above courtesy of Christopher Lucas

Here are two others that are fairly obscure:

Ortensia The Cat – Oswald the Lucky Rabbit’s wife. She appeared in several shorts and is now being used in new Disney projects with Oswald.  

Morty and Ferdie Field Mouse – Mickey’s nephews, the mouse counterparts of Huey, Dewey and Louie. They last appeared in Mickey’s Christmas Carol.  

46) Your actors who found a home at Disney listing was quite thorough, and I remembered all of those. The list of actors who bloomed at Disney was very memorable too. As per the child stars of Disney list, I did not know it was Virginia Davis who played Alice in the Alice comedies. I also did not know Luana Patten at all. Why do you think that might be? Christy Carlson Romano was another one I was not as aware of, but I think it may be the generation I fell in / my age. Do you think 90s Disney child stars stand out as much as classic ones? Why/why not? 

Until the advent of DVD, the early Alice shorts weren’t as well known to the public, so Virginia Davis (who was the first, but not the only young actress to play Alice in those early films) wasn’t as recognized as she should have been. Luana Patten is another one who didn’t get the attention that, say, Hayley Mills and Karen Dotrice got later. Many of the 1990s Disney TV stars went on to have successful recording careers. Christy Carlson Romano semi-retired after her shows ended, so she’s fallen out of the spotlight a bit.

Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

47) As per your list of classic voice-over actors for Disney animation, I did not know or did not remember Pinto Colvig did the early voice of Goofy. As he was brought back to do Goofy’s voice even after leaving the studio, why do you think more is not discussed about him? 

Colvig is a Disney Legend, and is an inductee in the International Clown Hall of Fame (he was the first Bozo) but he, like many voice artists of his era, worked for several studios and was the anonymous person behind the characters. Since the public only knows the character, his name never reached household status. Colvig’s vocal contributions to Goofy (the “hyuk, hyuk”, “gawrsh” and “Ya-hoo-hooey!” scream) do live on, however.

SnipIt of illustration from Top Disney. Used with permission of author

48) As per the classic voice-over list, I did not know Sterling Holloway, one of my favorites, was one (if not the only) of the voice-over actors to be named a Disney Legend. I loved all of his work. As he is a Southerner like me, I often found him to be a source of inspiration. Some of the roles he played, including Pooh and the Cheshire Cat with their distinct voices, make him a personal favorite of mine. Why do you think others like him and his work and respect him so much? Why do you think he was chosen as a Disney Legend? 

Sterling Holloway was already a well known star before he began lending his voice talents to Disney in the 1940s. His unique soft spoken southern tinged vocals are unmistakeable. Since Pooh is an icon of the Disney company, and the voice he gave to Pooh is as well, that’s why Holloway was given Disney Legend status.

49) I did not know the voice of Droopy Dog (please refresh my memory about his name) did character voices for Disney (from the classic Disney voice-over list). I should have guessed because some of them sound so similar. Was it easy for voice actors to “jump studios” back in the 40s? Was it easier for them to do so than live action actors? Why/why not? 

Radio was king in the 1930s and 40s, so many actors in Hollywood at the time were used to creating memorable performances with their voices alone. Walt and the other studio moguls were smart enough to tap in to all of that talent for their cartoons. Bill Thompson, who voiced Droopy, was one who hopped from project to project. Even the great Mel Blanc (best known for Bugs Bunny and 1,000 other Looney Tunes voices) worked for Disney at one time. Live action actors were usually under contract and associated with only one studio back then. 

50) From your modern Disney voice-over list, I knew more about Clarence Nash than his “feather apparent” Tony Anselmo as the voice of Donald Duck. Tell me more about Anselmo.  

Tony actually started as a junior animator at Disney back in 1980. He struck up a friendship with Clarence Nash, who began teaching him the finer points of performing Donald. When Nash passed away in 1985, Anselmo took over as the voice of Donald. Since then, it’s his voice you hear most of the time you’re listening to Donald squawk.

51) As per your list of Disney character actors, I did not know the three from the Golden Horseshoe Review, which, as a venue, I did grow acquainted with during my visit to Disneyland in 2015 (I am a life-long visitor to Walt Disney World but only in recent years was able to travel to Walt’s “original vision.”).

The three entertainers you referenced, Wally Boag, Fulton Burley and Betty Taylor, performed that show in Disneyland over 30,000 times, which was officially listed in the Guinness Book of World Records as the most ever for any show. That’s why they were given Disney Legend status.   

52) As per the Disney songwriters, why do I know the Sherman Brothers better than Oliver Wallace and Frank Churchhill? I know what each did, but why do you think the Sherman Brothers stick out more for me and perhaps others?

The Sherman Brothers had the good fortune of being Walt’s songwriters just as television was becoming more and more popular, and Disneyland records was established. In addition to their many film and TV scores, they wrote pop songs for Disney performers like Annette Funicello and then later theme songs for attractions at the Disney parks. That helped them become household names, almost as famous as any of Walt’s characters.  

53) I watched reruns of the 50s Mouseketeers on early Disney Channel in the 80s (I was a toddler in the late 70s and child of the 80s), but I had no idea the leader of the 50s Mouseketeers, Jimmie Dodd, was a minister and composer. I knew he played and sang many songs on the show, etc. Do you think there are similarities between him and the late Mr. Fred Rogers from “Mr. Roger’s Neighborhood” on PBS?

That’s another great analogy. Jimmie Dodd was a definite forerunner for Fred Rogers, and I wouldn’t be surprised if the latter took some inspiration from Dodd when putting together his long running children’s program.

SnipIt from Top Disney. Used with permission of author. 

54)  George Bruns and Buddy Baker were two composers that I knew little about biographically. Tell my audience more about them. 

Bruns and Baker both joined Disney after World War II. Between them and the Sherman Brothers, they account for almost every Disney song from the 1950s to the 1980s. Bruns and Baker’s work includes TV theme songs like “The Ballad of Davy Crockett,” film scores like the bouncy theme to “The Love Bug” and orchestral compositions for rides like the Haunted Mansion (yes, the creepy organ music.) When Baker retired from Disney in the 1980s, he was the last studio staff composer left in Hollywood. He continued consulting on musical projects for them until his death, at age 84, in 2002. 

Your book continues with various forms of media through the years and Disney’s role in them, which I have a broad familiarity with, so I will continue on to other topics… 

56) As per your live action T.V. series listing, the only one I have not seen is “The Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.” I like comics and comics films/shows at times. What am I missing with this one? 

This show is a small screen extension of the Marvel Cinematic Universe, with some tertiary characters from the films showing up and moving plot lines along that spill over into the movies. It’s an interesting show, which gives a little more depth to the mysterious organization run by Nick Fury in the movies.

57) As per your Made for TV film listing, I had no idea Disney made films for television about seeing-eye dogs. Why do you think Disney made these films? 

Walt was active in many charities for the disabled, and was a supporter of the Seeing Eye, the oldest guide dog operation in the U.S. Disney made not one, but two films about the Seeing Eye, filmed on location on their actual campus in New Jersey (the only time that’s ever happened.) I have a soft spot in my heart for those films, and the Seeing Eye, because my Dad is blind and had four Seeing Eye dogs throughout his life.  

58) I don’t think I ever saw a couple of the 70s made for television films Disney did. Did they ever make it to the early Disney Channel?

In the very beginning of the Disney Channel, from about 1983-1989, they used to show old episodes of the Wonderful World of Disney, including the 1970s movies. Due to residual and rights issues, many of those films are no longer aired or available, but you can usually find them posted on You Tube if you look hard enough. They are fun films, very high quality.

59) Having had Disney Channel in my childhood and youth and having been an educator for 15 years as well as being an uncle to a youth who is now 15, I knew most of the Disney Channel series from your list but did not know anything about “Lab Rats.” What was so special about that series?

Lab Rats is about a scientist who creates bionic superheroes and has them living under the same roof as his new wife and stepson. It’s a good example of the high concept sitcoms (“Dog With A Blog” is another one) that helped the Disney Channel and its spin-offs, like Disney XD, to big ratings.

60)  As per live-action Disney t.v. characters, I was not as familiar with the ones from the old Disney westerns. Were they shown much as re-runs? Why/why not? I had vague recollections of the non-western Swamp Fox and that series maybe being talking about or shown on Disney Channel. It may have been the historic connection to my home state. I loved re-runs of “Zorro” and watched them often.

Zorro and The Swamp Fox (South Carolina hero Francis Marion) were probably the two most famous Disney live action TV heroes early on, after Davy Crockett. Their memorable and catchy theme songs helped them stick in the mind and to be requested as re-runs on the Disney Channel and on home video. There were a few others, like Texas John Slaughter and Elfego Baca, who did not last as long in collective memories, so they haven’t been seen as much since.

 SnipIt of photo from Top Disney. Used with permission of author. 

61) By the way, Dr. Syn, in the classic live-action Disney show from your listing, scared me nearly to death as a youth in his Scarecrow costume, though he was more of a “dark knight” on the side of good, etc. How about you? 

Dr. Syn, or the Scarecrow of Romney Marsh, was very much in the tradition of Zorro and Batman; dashing heroes with a dark double identity. You are right, in that the image of the Scarecrow roaming the British countryside for justice in the middle of the night was absolutely terrifying. It still gives me chills.

62) Stanley Griff was one of the few Disney t.v. animated characters I knew nothing about. Others were ones young relatives had watched or that I had seen in passing. Why do you think Stanley Griff does not stand out? 

Stanley was a kids cartoon that mixed a bit of education in each episode. His “Great Big Book of Everything” was like a magic encyclopedia that could transport Stanley and his pals to any place or time to give some historic facts to kids. A similar show, “Little Einsteins” stole a bit of Stanley’s plot line and thunder a few years later and became more notable.

63) I had never heard of Disney’s touring / theatrical production “Total Abandon” in one of your lists? Was it because it was not successful? Was it a good production? 

I did not see it live, so I can’t give a personal opinion as to the quality of the show, but I can say that it was not a big hit. In fact, it was one of Broadway’s biggest flops ever, closing on opening night, only running for one performance. Richard Dreyfus starred as an abusive father, in an unsympathetic role, which might have kept ticket sales down. Critics also roasted it. Disney didn’t come back to Broadway for another decade, and then it was with a safe version of one of their biggest animated hit musicals, “Beauty and the Beast”, which ran for years.

64) “On the Record” was another touring show I had never heard of. Did it get much publicity?

“On The Record” was a 2004 jukebox style musical, like “Mamma Mia,” with a story built around pre-existing songs. In this case, it was 71 songs from the Disney canon. It never made it to Broadway, but traveled to 25 cities around the United States, where audiences and critics gave it high marks. It’s still being performed by repertory, community and high school theater groups. It sometimes plays in an abridged version, with another title, “When You Wish.”

    

Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

65) I was very familiar with the Disney Parks chronology in the book but somehow had a lapse about Ronald Reagan’s historic connection to the Disney Parks. Care to elaborate on this? 

Ronald Reagan was a friend of Walt Disney, and co-hosted opening day ceremonies for Disneyland on television, years before he entered politics. For his second Presidential Inaugural in January 1985, the temperature in Washington D.C. was 15 degrees below zero. They cancelled all outdoor celebrations, disappointing the thousands who’d traveled there to see the historic event. Michael Eisner made the offer to host the Inauguration ceremonies in May at Epcot Center. The President accepted. On Memorial Day, 1985, the Secret Service took over Epcot as 60,000 people showed up to see the President and First Lady. The official Presidential Inaugural Parade was held around the lagoon in Epcot, marking the first time since the 1780s that such a ceremony was held outside of the nation’s capital. 

Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas

66) I mentioned Eisner earlier in one of the interviews and some of the criticisms of him. Do you think Eisner made the Disney Parks better? Why/why not? 

The parks were in danger of turning into well maintained museum pieces in the mid 1980s. Eisner made it his mission to reinvigorate and expand the parks and resorts world wide. He even dubbed the 1990s “The Disney Decade.” He had some great triumphs and some great failures, but he has to be given credit for his ambitious plan, which changed the way the world looks at theme parks going into the 21^st Century. 

SnipIt of photo from Top Disney. Used with permission of author  

67) What do you think about the direction Bob Iger is taking the parks in? I thoroughly enjoyed your listing of parks-only characters, by the way. 

Bob Iger is a little more cautious than Michael Eisner, who was a “dream big, worry about money later” guy, like Walt. Iger sees the big picture of the Disney Corporation, where the parks make up only about 35% of the annual revenue. Nevertheless, his moves – like adding two new Star Wars lands, modern thrill rides, an award winning Avatar land, and technology to help improve guest experiences – haven’t been a splashy as Eisner’s, but are leading the parks in the right direction for the next CEO to inherit.

68)   In the listing of “dead attractions” (well, “The Haunted Mansion” is dead in a different way), you mentioned “If You Had Wings.” Was air travel just not that much of a novelty any more once it had died out? 

Eastern Airlines was the official carrier of Walt Disney World for years, the two were synonymous. They sponsored “If You Had Wings.” When more airlines started to pop up, air travel became cheaper and competition fiercer, Eastern faltered. Once they were gone, the attraction’s days were numbered. The coolest part of the ride, the tunnel that made it appear that you were swooshing through hyperspace, is still there. It’s now part of the finale of the Buzz Lightyear attraction in Tomorrowland, which replaced “If You Had Wings” in that same building.

I enjoyed your list of under-rated Disney Parks attractions and agreed with them whole-heartedly. 

You have many nice bibliographies within your book as well. 

Your reference book is a very comprehensive book of lists that any Disney fan would treasure having upon his or her shelf. Thank you for agreeing to be interviewed for this series of articles based on your book, Christopher.

Shown is part of Christopher Lucas’ large VHS collection of Disney films as well part of his collection of mouse ears from the Disney Parks. He also has many books related to Disney on separate shelves. Photo courtesy of Christopher Lucas.